[ALAC] [ALAC-Announce] VOTE ANNOUNCEMENT: ALS Application (307) Internet Society Rural Development Special Interest Group

Dev Anand Teelucksingh devtee at gmail.com
Mon Sep 23 14:08:21 UTC 2019


 Good to see a discussion on possible At-Large models. A possible
alternative :

ICANN establishes At-Large Chapters in each country similiar in concept to
Rotary or ISOC chapters.

- each chapter is open to anyone interested in ICANN from the interests of
end users.
- ICANN can set guidelines for each chapter - some examples: must do
certain level of outreach, have term limits, have a public F2F awareness
meeting to recruit new persons. ICANN would need to provide some funding to
make this happen but this would be small and the chapters can account to
ICANN for expenses.
- ICANN can provide the tools (mailing lists, conference tools) to
facilitate online discussions.
- Because there is a consistent brand - At-Large Chapter in the country,
marketing/promoting is greatly simplified and easier to explain.
- Given that such chapters are virtual, it makes chapters easy to establish
with only a few individuals from a country without the challenges of having
formal organisations with bylaws and pay taxes.

So an At-Large chapter ends up being a virtual ALS in each country in the
ALAC/RALO/ALS model.

The RALOs will consist of the chapters from each country in the region with
each chapter electing two persons to coordinate the RALO work. The RALO
will be better positioned to better fulfil its MOUs with ICANN and the RALO
and ALAC would not have to bother with analysing whether an organisation
meets the criteria of an ALS.

The At-Large chapters will be better able to network with At-Large chapters
in other countries and build consensus on policy issues and help promote
and grow the At-Large Community.

Dev Anand


On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 2:31 PM Judith Hellerstein <judith at jhellerstein.com>
wrote:

> Hi Kaili
> Very interesting analysis. I support it. You seem to have given it a lot
> of thought
>
> Best
> Judith
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> Judith at jhellerstein.com
> Skype ID:Judithhellerstein
>
> On Sep 20, 2019, at 1:27 PM, Kaili Kan <kankaili at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Very interesting discussion indeed, and certainly a challenging issue.
>
> As I understand, end-users could be categorized in many many ways, e.g.,
> by gender, by age, by religion, by nationality, by regions, etc.  That is,
> it is a multi-dimensional problem per se.  However, for the purpose of
> organizing the billions into groups, we did it in only one dimension, i.e.,
> according to geographic locality (ALSs), then into regions (RALOs), and
> then into global (ALAC).  This is because in the real world, nations,
> language and culture play a dominating role in our life.  Each locality
> represents a (roughly) unified such factors, while nations and regions
> represent such similarities in a larger scale.
>
> However, this on-dimensional categorization cannot rule out other
> dimensions, or (special) interests, neither the following special interest
> groups (SIGs).  Can we add other dimensions?  Of course we can.  However,
> that will make our organization into a (multi-dimensional) matrix structure
> instead of our current one dimensional top-down (or bottom-up) structure.
> How would ICANN operate under such a structure?  Especially, how do we
> vote to make decisions?  I don't know, and I don't think anybody knows.
> Thus, I do not see an easy solution to our problem.
>
> Therefore, I believe the best we can do is to find some way to
> compromise.  That is, to provide a chance for these SIGs to have their
> voice heard, but not to jeopardize our current one-dimensional structure.
>
> In light of all the above, I would be in favor of not "officially"
> admitting an SIG without a regional identification as an ALS, but to
> welcome them in all our activities as "members" (not necessarily
> "individual members"), regardless of regions.  On the other hand, within
> RALOs, as long as we cannot figure a way to change our one-dimensional
> structure, we preserve the rarely exercised voting rights to official ALSs
> (plus the rep of individual members).
>
> Meanwhile, I believe the non-affiliation requirement for individual
> members could be taken out, for I don't think it contributes much in any
> way.  However, in the case of voting, the representative of individual
> members should primarily represent those who are unaffiliated.
>
> As a final note, I would still support the pending ALS to be admitted to
> APRALO as an ALS.  This is because, at least for the time being, its
> presence is still primarily within the APRALO territory.  In addition, I do
> not see any harm to anybody by admitting them, again, for the time being.
>
> Furthermore, if our five RALOs cannot agree to a single solution, I would
> suggest the Bylaws be changed into each RALO will be able to decide for
> themselves.  Anyway, ALAC's voting is according to regions instead of ALSs.
>
> Thank you all.
>
> Kaili
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 20, 2019 at 9:41 AM Holly Raiche <h.raiche at internode.on.net>
> wrote:
>
>> I agree with Alan on this one and I”d favor option 2 - develop a category
>> of membership for organizations that represent a section of the interests
>> of end users but do not have a particular geographic base.
>>
>> Holly
>>
>> On Sep 20, 2019, at 1:12 AM, Cheryl Langdon-Orr <langdonorr at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I would also just point out the observation that at this point in the
>> evolution and development of ALAC/At-Large with our ARIWG operations
>> looking at our ongoing implementation of Recommendations from the last
>> review 8and* the emerging discussions and work in implementation of
>> Recommendation #2 in particular, this is an ideal time to have this
>> discussion and propose ofter full deliberation and possible changed of our
>> Rules as outlined by Alan for example...   So timing is good and you have a
>> case to consider at the right time to do so in non-hypothetical terms...
>>
>> <https://about.me/cheryl.LangdonOrr?promo=email_sig&utm_source=product&utm_medium=email_sig&utm_campaign=gmail_api&utm_content=thumb>
>> Cheryl Langdon-Orr
>> about.me/cheryl.LangdonOrr
>> <https://about.me/cheryl.LangdonOrr?promo=email_sig&utm_source=product&utm_medium=email_sig&utm_campaign=gmail_api&utm_content=thumb>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, 19 Sep 2019 at 17:03, Tijani BEN JEMAA <tijani.benjemaa at topnet.tn>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Alan,
>>>
>>> "but I have an aversion for doing things in violation of our own rules
>>> and the ICANN Bylaws."
>>> I agree 100%
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca> a écrit :
>>>
>>> This is not a result of just our "rules", but is also a core principle
>>> from the ICANN Bylaws. I quote:
>>>
>>> *The criteria and standards for the certification of At-Large Structures
>>> shall be established in such a way that participation by individual
>>> Internet users who are citizens or residents of countries within the
>>> Geographic Region of the RALO will predominate in the operation of each
>>> At-Large Structure within the RALO, while not necessarily excluding
>>> additional participation, compatible with the interests of the individual
>>> Internet users within the region, by others.*
>>>
>>>
>>> I see two ways of "fixing" this. Both would require a Bylaw change
>>> (certainly possible).
>>>
>>> 1. Abolish RALOs and have all ALSes and unaffiliated members be one
>>> amorphous mass. This removes the need to identify an ALS with a specific
>>> RALO, since there are none.
>>>
>>> 2. Develop the concept of an ALS which crosses RALOs and thus does not
>>> belong to any of them.
>>>
>>> If indeed we have a potential ALS that will really help At-Large, we
>>> don't want to lose them, but I have an aversion for doing things in
>>> violation of our own rules and the ICANN Bylaws.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>> At 17/09/2019 11:53 PM, Maureen Hilyard wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Olivier
>>>
>>> Maybe the rules need changing. Just because a group has members  from
>>> all over the world, why should we stop them from becoming members of
>>> At-Large.
>>>
>>> The group currently had a leadership team whose members are all resident
>>> in the APRALO region. They are one of the few applications that I have seen
>>> that actually mentioned the DNS. As an ISOC chapter focusing on rural
>>> development, it probably has a majority of members from APRALO if all of
>>> its leadership team is from the same region.
>>>
>>> Since our current rules only note the primary and secondary members of
>>> an ALS regardless of who is most active in our work in At-Large, when it
>>> comes to who the other members are, no-one really bothers to ask. I would
>>> hazard a guess that if we were to do an analysis  (and were to be so picky)
>>> we would have several groups that have global  members.
>>>
>>> *If we get active participants out of this ALS* we should count
>>> ourselves lucky. That is the whole point of our ALS recruitment process.
>>> And as part of our Review we are finding that many of our processes need
>>> updating to keep up with the changing needs of the environments we are
>>> having to deal with.
>>>
>>> EURALO itself has been faced with an anomaly which does not fit the
>>> rules, but we have found LACRALO to be very obliging to cater for it. And
>>> as we revise our ALS Criteria and Expectations we will have to include a
>>> new "rule" that allows for  ALSes to participate in an event on a
>>> neighbouring country that "does not belong to the region in which they are
>>> situated". BIKLAB is now a precedent which will allow this to happen more
>>> within our system as long as there is agreement between the regions
>>> concerned.
>>>
>>> APRALO has many small island countries in the Pacific that have been
>>> unable to participate in ICANN activities in their own right under our
>>> current rules because they are territories of big power countries (mainly
>>> in EURALO) who are given no support from their home region and would have
>>> no idea what EURALO was. Pacific countries are an anomaly because as all
>>> the 22 countries and territories of the Pacific are members of the Pacific
>>> Forum, they are therefore members of PICISOC, so in fact are members of an
>>> ALS already -- so we have international participants in our membership,
>>> even though they live in the Pacific.
>>>
>>> Maureen
>>>
>>> On Tue, 17 Sep 2019, 3:14 PM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, <ocl at gih.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> Dear Maureen,
>>>   I am very surprised to see this having reached the ALAC with a
>>> recommendation from APRALO that this should be accepted. This should have
>>> been picked up at Due Diligence: Internet Society Special Interest Groups
>>> are global as per the explanation on
>>> https://www.internetsociety.org/sigs This countervenes ALAC rules which
>>> specify that ALSes must be geographical. See
>>> tinyurl.com/ALAC-RoP-AdjDoc4-2013-07
>>>   "2. Be organised so that participation by individual Internet users
>>> who are citizens or residents of countries within the Geographic Region in
>>> which the ALS is based will predominate in the ALS' operation. The ALS may
>>> permit additional participation by others that is compatible with the
>>> interests of the individual Internet users within the region."
>>>   The key words are "be organised" - and as much as I support the work
>>> of the Internet Society Rurel Special Interest Group, rural areas are not
>>> limited to Asia. Unless there is a commitment that this SIG will restrict
>>> the majority of its membership to come from the Asia region. The explicit
>>> response of the SIG in due diligence was "this is a global SIG".
>>>   I also have a concern that it would be possible to create one SIG
>>> after another in ISOC and the meaning of ALS no longer applies as you are
>>> effectively creating votes.
>>>   The question of "geographical" was asked on the APRALO mailing list
>>> as recently as 11 September 2019 (
>>> https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/pipermail/apac-discuss/2019-September/004952.html
>>> ) but I do not see any response to this.
>>>   Kindest regards,
>>>   Olivier
>>>   On 18/09/2019 01:58, ICANN At-Large Staff wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear All,
>>>
>>>   The regional advice from APRALO regarding the ALS Application (307)
>>> Internet Society Rural Development Special Interest Group has been received.
>>>
>>>   The following question has been posed to the ALAC:
>>>
>>>   *****
>>>   Question: Does the ALAC wish to accredit the (307) Internet Society
>>> Rural Development Special Interest Group? The regional advice was to accept
>>> the application.
>>>   *****
>>>
>>>   Please note that this vote will close on Tuesday, 24 September 2019
>>> 23:59 UTC.
>>>
>>>   Kind Regards,
>>>
>>>   ICANN Policy Staff in support of the At-Large Community
>>>   Website: atlarge.icann.org
>>>   Facebook: facebook.com/icann <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge>
>>> atlarge <https://www.facebook.com/icannatlarge>
>>>   Twitter: @ <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge> ICANNAtLarge
>>> <https://twitter.com/ICANNAtLarge>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> *Tijani BENJEMAA*
>>> Executive Director
>>> Mediterranean Federation of Internet Associations (*FMAI*)
>>> Telephone: +216 52 385 114
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
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