[ALAC] [ALAC-Announce] VOTE ANNOUNCEMENT: ALS Application (307) Internet Society Rural Development Special Interest Group
Sergio Salinas Porto
presidencia at internauta.org.ar
Thu Sep 19 22:59:06 UTC 2019
Mi opinión es personal Alberto, no estoy hablando desde LACRALO, sino lo
hubiese dicho en el email que envié, no entiendo por qué lo preguntas,
surge alguna idea diferente de lo que escribi?
*Sergio Salinas Porto**Presidente Internauta Argentina - LACRALO/ICANN
<https://atlarge.icann.org/ralos/lacralo>**Asociación Argentina de
Usuarios de Internet <http://www.internauta.org.ar/>/FeTIA
<http://www.fetia.org.ar/>**FUILAC- Federación de Usuarios de Internet
de LAC <https://fuilac.org>**facebook: salinasporto
<http://www.facebook.com/salinasporto> **twitter: sergiosalinas
<http://twitter.com/sergiosalinas>**Mobi:+54 9 223 5 215819**"Ojalá
podamos ser desobedientes, cada vez que recibimos órdenes que humillan
nuestra *
* conciencia o violan nuestro sentido común" Eduardo Galeano*
El jue., 19 sept. 2019 a las 18:15, Alberto Soto (<alberto at soto.net.ar>)
escribió:
> Sergio, please clarify if your ipiniòn is personal or LACRALO.
>
> Regards
>
>
>
> Alberto
>
>
>
> *De: *ALAC <alac-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org> en nombre de Sergio
> Salinas Porto <presidencia at internauta.org.ar>
> *Fecha: *jueves, 19 de septiembre de 2019, 17:57
> *Para: *Eduardo Diaz <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>
> *CC: *ALAC <alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org>, Alan Greenberg <
> alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca>
> *Asunto: *Re: [ALAC] [ALAC-Announce] VOTE ANNOUNCEMENT: ALS Application
> (307) Internet Society Rural Development Special Interest Group
>
>
>
> Dear, I hope the google translator works well.
> Without offending, I think we are missing the road.
> If any of those who are here are in conflict with whether they represent a
> collective interest or if they represent themselves, it would be good to
> know.
> I don't have that conflict and neither do my regional partners.
> The ALS are representatives of organizations of Internet users accredited
> as such for the defense of the interests of the users of our countries, we
> represent collective and non-individual interests.
> Individual interests should, in my opinion, be addressed elsewhere than
> ALAC (they could create another constituency and propose it to the ICANN
> board).
> We were obliged to accept individual users and we have done so much to our
> regret, I think we should not pull more of the rope.
> For me, such a discussion is just a waste of time.
>
> *Sergio Salinas Porto*
>
> *Presidente Internauta Argentina - LACRALO/ICANN <https://atlarge.icann.org/ralos/lacralo>*
>
> *Asociación Argentina de Usuarios de Internet <http://www.internauta.org.ar/>/FeTIA <http://www.fetia.org.ar/>*
>
> *FUILAC- Federación de Usuarios de Internet de LAC <https://fuilac.org>*
>
> *facebook: salinasporto <http://www.facebook.com/salinasporto> *
>
> *twitter: sergiosalinas <http://twitter.com/sergiosalinas>*
>
> *Mobi:+54 9 223 5 215819*
>
> *"Ojalá podamos ser desobedientes, cada vez que recibimos órdenes que humillan nuestra *
>
> * conciencia o violan nuestro sentido común" Eduardo Galeano*
>
>
>
>
>
> El jue., 19 sept. 2019 a las 17:38, Eduardo Diaz (<
> eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>) escribió:
>
> Maureen:
>
>
>
> No, I was suggesting that we eliminate the ALs concept all together and
> make everyone Individual Members. The way I see it the more I liked even
> though I was initially in disagreement with this when the final review
> report was published. The way we are set-up today is around who has voting
> rights and who does not.
>
>
>
> Let's take as an example the ALs that is under the ALAC vote know. This is
> an ISOC global organization. If it gets approved to become part of the
> APRALO then those members that are not in the AP region will not be able to
> be affiliated with their own region at all because they are affiliated
> somewhere else. This set-up is certainly not good for engagement.
>
>
>
>
>
> -ed
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 19, 2019 at 3:51 PM Maureen Hilyard <maureen.hilyard at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> I thought Eduardo was suggesting that those who were not from the region
> within such a group could apply for individual membership, but whereas our
> qualification for individual membership is currently only unaffiliated,
> that we might also have affiliated members to cater for this category of
> members - perhaps as observers from another region, which was a
> classification that Roberto wanted to raise in Montreal. Perhaps we should
> have a session on this on Sat/Sun.
>
>
>
> M
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 19, 2019 at 9:11 AM Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca>
> wrote:
>
> Are you suggesting remove the concept of ALSes and have only individual
> members?
>
> Alan
>
> At 19/09/2019 12:00 PM, Eduardo Diaz wrote:
>
> Another possibility is to keep the RALOs, so the concept of regional views
> is maintained, but make each of its participants individual members and
> remove the concept of unaffiliated.
>
> -ed
>
> On Wed, Sep 18, 2019 at 10:11 PM Alan Greenberg <alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca
> > wrote:
>
> This is not a result of just our "rules", but is also a core principle
> from the ICANN Bylaws. I quote:
>
>
> The criteria and standards for the certification of At-Large Structures
> shall be established in such a way that participation by individual
> Internet users who are citizens or residents of countries within the
> Geographic Region of the RALO will predominate in the operation of each
> At-Large Structure within the RALO, while not necessarily excluding
> additional participation, compatible with the interests of the individual
> Internet users within the region, by others.
>
>
>
> I see two ways of "fixing" this. Both would require a Bylaw change
> (certainly possible).
>
> 1. Abolish RALOs and have all ALSes and unaffiliated members be one
> amorphous mass. This removes the need to identify an ALS with a specific
> RALO, since there are none.
>
> 2. Develop the concept of an ALS which crosses RALOs and thus does not
> belong to any of them.
>
> If indeed we have a potential ALS that will really help At-Large, we don't
> want to lose them, but I have an aversion for doing things in violation of
> our own rules and the ICANN Bylaws.
>
> Alan
>
> At 17/09/2019 11:53 PM, Maureen Hilyard wrote:
>
> Hi Olivier
>
> Maybe the rules need changing. Just because a group has members from all
> over the world, why should we stop them from becoming members of At-Large.
>
> The group currently had a leadership team whose members are all resident
> in the APRALO region. They are one of the few applications that I have seen
> that actually mentioned the DNS. As an ISOC chapter focusing on rural
> development, it probably has a majority of members from APRALO if all of
> its leadership team is from the same region.
>
> Since our current rules only note the primary and secondary members of an
> ALS regardless of who is most active in our work in At-Large, when it comes
> to who the other members are, no-one really bothers to ask. I would hazard
> a guess that if we were to do an analysis (and were to be so picky) we
> would have several groups that have global members.
>
> If we get active participants out of this ALS we should count ourselves
> lucky. That is the whole point of our ALS recruitment process. And as part
> of our Review we are finding that many of our processes need updating to
> keep up with the changing needs of the environments we are having to deal
> with.
>
> EURALO itself has been faced with an anomaly which does not fit the rules,
> but we have found LACRALO to be very obliging to cater for it. And as we
> revise our ALS Criteria and Expectations we will have to include a new
> "rule" that allows for ALSes to participate in an event on a neighbouring
> country that "does not belong to the region in which they are situated".
> BIKLAB is now a precedent which will allow this to happen more within our
> system as long as there is agreement between the regions concerned.
>
> APRALO has many small island countries in the Pacific that have been
> unable to participate in ICANN activities in their own right under our
> current rules because they are territories of big power countries (mainly
> in EURALO) who are given no support from their home region and would have
> no idea what EURALO was. Pacific countries are an anomaly because as all
> the 22 countries and territories of the Pacific are members of the Pacific
> Forum, they are therefore members of PICISOC, so in fact are members of an
> ALS already -- so we have international participants in our membership,
> even though they live in the Pacific.
>
> Maureen
>
> On Tue, 17 Sep 2019, 3:14 PM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, <ocl at gih.com>
> wrote:
>
> Dear Maureen,
>
> I am very surprised to see this having reached the ALAC with a
> recommendation from APRALO that this should be accepted. This should have
> been picked up at Due Diligence: Internet Society Special Interest Groups
> are global as per the explanation on https://www.internetsociety.org/sigs
>
> This countervenes ALAC rules which specify that ALSes must be
> geographical. See tinyurl.com/ALAC-RoP-AdjDoc4-2013-07
>
> "2. Be organised so that participation by individual Internet users who
> are citizens or residents of countries within the Geographic Region in
> which the ALS is based will predominate in the ALS' operation. The ALS may
> permit additional participation by others that is compatible with the
> interests of the individual Internet users within the region."
>
> The key words are "be organised" - and as much as I support the work of
> the Internet Society Rurel Special Interest Group, rural areas are not
> limited to Asia. Unless there is a commitment that this SIG will restrict
> the majority of its membership to come from the Asia region. The explicit
> response of the SIG in due diligence was "this is a global SIG".
>
> I also have a concern that it would be possible to create one SIG after
> another in ISOC and the meaning of ALS no longer applies as you are
> effectively creating votes.
>
> The question of "geographical" was asked on the APRALO mailing list as
> recently as 11 September 2019 (
> https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/pipermail/apac-discuss/2019-September/004952.html
> ) but I do not see any response to this.
>
> Kindest regards,
>
> Olivier
>
> On 18/09/2019 01:58, ICANN At-Large Staff wrote:
>
> Dear All,
>
>
>
> The regional advice from APRALO regarding the ALS Application (307)
> Internet Society Rural Development Special Interest Group has been received.
>
>
>
> The following question has been posed to the ALAC:
>
>
>
> *****
>
> Question: Does the ALAC wish to accredit the (307) Internet Society Rural
> Development Special Interest Group? The regional advice was to accept the
> application.
>
> *****
>
>
>
> Please note that this vote will close on Tuesday, 24 September 2019 23:59
> UTC.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
>
>
> ICANN Policy Staff in support of the At-Large Community
>
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