[NA-Discuss] Voting None of the Above Re: …

Kieren McCarthy kierenmccarthy at gmail.com
Fri Jul 20 15:36:09 UTC 2012

Hi Garth, all

So here's the thing. If elected to a key post in a grassroots organization,
being asked questions like: how many members do you have, how many
subscribers, what level of engagement -- should be an opportunity to
demonstrate effectiveness (especially when seeking re-election) and the
answers should be immediately accessible.

If asked about a Facebook page, or a Twitter account, or a report of the
recent meeting which is the organization's entire reason for existing, then
the answers should already be known and easily provided, perhaps with a
certain amount of pride.

This basic level of commitment by elected representatives is the foundation
on which other things can be built. If there is such a foundation and if
questions from members are seen as a positive and useful form of
engagement, then you will find that not only I but a lot of other people
would be willing to help out, to do work (without insisting on being paid
for it), and to promote the organization.


On Fri, Jul 20, 2012 at 7:48 AM, Garth Bruen at Knujon.com <
gbruen at knujon.com> wrote:

> Kieren, I think your critique of what needs to be done is correct but
> there is difference between saying "this must be done by you" and "this
> must be done and I will do this part of it" among a group of volunteers.
> We're all aware of the weak volume of participation, and this can be fixed.
> What can't be denied is the quality of participation. The expertise and
> dedication among this group is remarkable. Before joining At-Large I was
> running my volunteer effort with success in specific areas. But since
> working with At-Large that success has improved and I've had the honor of
> helping others within the group with various efforts.
> We've made positive policy changes and gotten the attention of the board,
> staff and "others." Registrars regularly lurk on this thread along with
> anonymous (NON)At-Large support ICANN staff. That's pretty shocking and
> wouldn't happen if we were not having an impact. No one inside the inner
> circle would care what we said otherwise.
> If you can use your far-reaching voice to highlight the success of this
> group it would help get new interest and support for existing initiatives.
> Interview some members and document what they do, so then readers will see
> how their Internet problems could also be addressed.
> -Garth
> ------------------------------**--------------------
> From: "Kieren McCarthy" <kierenmccarthy at gmail.com>
> Sent: Friday, July 20, 2012 9:40 AM
> To: "NA-Discuss Discuss" <na-discuss at atlarge-lists.**icann.org<na-discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
> >
> Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] Voting None of the Above Re: …
>  Well I think you've both just answered the question as to why there are
>> so few people engaged in NARALO.
>> Kieren
>> [from mobile device]
>> On Jul 20, 2012, at 3:50 AM, "Thompson, Darlene" <DThompson1 at GOV.NU.CA>
>> wrote:
>>  +1
>>> Very well said.
>>> D
>>> Darlene A. Thompson
>>> CAP Administrator
>>> N-CAP/Department of Education
>>> P.O. Box 1000, Station 910
>>> Iqaluit, NU  X0A 0H0
>>> Phone:  (867) 975-5631
>>> Fax:  (867) 975-5610
>>> dthompson at gov.nu.ca
>>> ______________________________**__________
>>> From: na-discuss-bounces at atlarge-**lists.icann.org<na-discuss-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org>[
>>> na-discuss-bounces at atlarge-**lists.icann.org<na-discuss-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org>]
>>> on behalf of Evan Leibovitch [evan at telly.org]
>>> Sent: Friday, July 20, 2012 2:20 AM
>>> To: Kieren McCarthy
>>> Cc: NA-Discuss Discuss
>>> Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss]       Voting None of the Above Re: …
>>> On 19 July 2012 12:39, Kieren McCarthy <kierenmccarthy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> *At the risk at getting embroiled in pointless name-calling, John I think
>>>> you are demonstrating precisely the mindset that is behind the reason
>>>> that
>>>> only one person is standing for each of the four positions.*
>>> Kieren, you *are* getting embrolied in pointless name calling.
>>> Funny that you suddenly seem so interested in At-Large issues when it
>>> comes
>>> to our internals.  We've been active in promoting end-user sensibilities
>>> in
>>> WHOIS, gTLD, trademark, internationalization and other issues. I've
>>> personally been trying -- practically begging, since before Prague -- to
>>> get you to even LOOK at the R3 white paper At-Large has produced, an
>>> broadly-crafted attempt to make ICANN more representative of (and
>>> accountable to) the world at large. You've been WAY too busy for that.
>>> But
>>> not too busy to gawk at an unfortunate personal issue, and pass judgement
>>> on a consensus process that seems to work for most. Like most
>>> decision-making systems, it's imperfect. But it does result in NARALO
>>> members' initiating more than its share of ALAC policy initiatives, and
>>> still being the one of the only regions with a formal acceptance of
>>> participants who aren't part of an ALS.
>>> And yet... Rather than focus on the substance of what we're actually
>>> trying
>>> to say -- which you have completely ignored to date -- you seek to dwell
>>> on
>>> the "what gives you the right to say it?" approach.
>>> Sorry there wasn't any tabloid fodder for you on Monday (the first NARALO
>>> call you've attended ... ever?). No meltdown. Not even raised voices.
>>> Just
>>> talk about policy, planning for the Toronto meeting, and ensuring the
>>> everyone who had something to say on our internal issues was heard,
>>> Smoothly run and ended on time. But judging from your takeaway comments,
>>> Plan B appears to be focusing on why At-Large doesn't function more like
>>> Amway.
>>> *So here are some questions:*
>>> Really? REALLY?
>>> Are you really asking volunteers to provide the research that you will
>>> then
>>> turn around and sell to others?
>>> And then complain that we don't have enough time for <insert your pet
>>> issue
>>> here>?
>>> If your questions are intended to discover holes in ICANN's At-Large
>>> outreach strategies, you'll have an easy time of it once you do the
>>> research. If your intentions are indeed constructive, you're welcome to
>>> join us in advocating At-Large growth through anywhere near the kind of
>>> resources that ICANN expends to grow its pool of registrars and TLDs. But
>>> the tone just appears as building a case for diverting our limited
>>> volunteer resources away from understanding and shaping the ICANN
>>> labyrinth, and towards recruitment. No thanks.
>>> My ALS (and a number of others) was discovered and brought in by Jacob
>>> Malthouse, an ICANN staffer whose job it was to go out and engage members
>>> of the public who'd never heard of ICANN -- let alone cared about it --
>>>  and
>>> convince them to get them involved. Jacob's job was difficult; too bad
>>> you
>>> can't ask him about it because his position no longer exists, so it's no
>>> surprise the job isn't being done anymore. NARALO has made proposals to
>>> duplicate this task using volunteers instead of staff, but our request to
>>> get even basic expenses covered for this project has been turned down for
>>> two (or it it three?) years in a row.
>>> *These are basic questions, basic steps for a grassroots organization.
>>>> And they all cost $0.*
>>> How sad that you consider volunteer time to be worthless. Mine isn't.
>>> - Evan
>>> ------
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>>> Visit the NARALO online at http://www.naralo.org
>>> ------
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