[At-Large] ATLASIII Participation
jlaprise at gmail.com
Tue Jul 9 22:32:10 UTC 2019
On Tue, Jul 9, 2019, 5:09 PM Greg Shatan <greg at isoc-ny.org> wrote:
> I have no problem with volunteers giving as much or as little of their
> time as they can. This is not about judging the measure of one’s
> participation. Every bit helps.
> Time is a limited resource. So is travel funding. Both should be
> valued. Neither should be wasted.
> For a person to take money intended to bring a person to a place to do a
> thing, and then not doing that thing to the best of their ability is a
> selfish squandering of resources. And it is likely to deny the opportunity
> to another volunteer who can better use that resource.
> I agree that travel funding is (as Carlton says) “a tool to get the job
> done.” Taking the funding and then not using it fully to get the job done
> is like taking a bag of hammers and throwing them in the river. Why give
> that person more hammers?
> This is not about hypothecation or compensation. This is about waste.
> We don’t need to have draconian or arbitrary punishments. We do have to
> stop wasting our resources — whether it is time, funding or reputation. If
> there is a good faith explanation why someone takes money to bring them to
> Atlas III and then misses most of the sessions, we should hear it (real
> life and job disasters can come up at any time).
> If a volunteer can’t commit fully to participating in Atlas III (or any
> other thing), that is perfectly fine. Just don’t take the money intended
> to support a limited number of people in that participation.
> On Tue, Jul 9, 2019 at 5:30 PM John Laprise <jlaprise at gmail.com> wrote:
>> People who choose to take offense at accountability and responsibility
>> (even as a volunteer), choose to be offended.
>> Please note that I believe that while I may have initially referenced
>> travel funding, I meant to include all funding and ineligibility for
>> elected positions to be fair. If we cannot rely on a volunteer on a single
>> dedicated occasion, it is foolish to rely on such an individual in other
>> circumstances, volunteer or not.
>> We disagree.
>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2019, 4:15 PM Carlton Samuels <carlton.samuels at gmail.com>
>>> Dear John:
>>> I know you mean well. But I must register my profound and utter
>>> disagreement with you here. And, on principle.
>>> At-Large representatives are volunteers. Largely.
>>> I am seethe at this indignity that a measure of my voluntarism connects
>>> to me flying somewhere to volunteer my time, my energy, my intellectual
>>> capital and yes, my labour, all as public goods.
>>> I would not wish to be so judged. And what is proposed is nothing but
>>> an episode of the slave's torment; doing what he thinks would appease his
>>> master by providing the hog grease for the leather whip that stipes his own
>>> I came to this opposition from bitter experience. It started when I was
>>> the only elected LACRALO official. And in a period when travel was dangled
>>> as a benefit to volunteers. I couldn't give a tinker's damn since by that
>>> time I had already racked up 2 million plus airmiles. And traveling
>>> steerage class is not my idea of a fun time.
>>> In that period of time, LACRALO arguably provided the most egregious
>>> examples of the ICANN tourist traveler. And I suffered the slings of my
>>> northern metropolitan colleagues for vehemently opposing sanctions on the
>>> then LACRALO ALAC representatives. [I am ever grateful to Evan for
>>> supporting me on principle!] My argument was those persons behaved badly as
>>> individuals. I told them so. One has hated me to this day. But inspite of
>>> him, I adamantly refused to support travel sanctions against them. That
>>> action reinforces that rather louche idea that travel is a benefit rather
>>> than the tool that it is to get a job done. And to hypothecate the tool as
>>> security for work to be done seems immoral to me.
>>> Value is assigned my time and intellectual capital by others; I sell
>>> them for fee. I got home less than 2 hours ago from Suriname. Most in this
>>> thread would likely not even know where that is. it is a hump to get to.
>>> And, somebody paid me for that.
>>> As a volunteer, my time, intellectual capital and my own coin have been
>>> placed in trust and in the service of the At-Large. An airplane ticket in
>>> steerage does not begin to compensate me as volunteer. It is no benefit to
>>> me or for me. It is rude and crude to suggest, must less legislate, that
>>> it is.
>>> My position has not changed in these many years because the same
>>> response offends reason and conscience. It is for the At-Large constituents
>>> to pick representatives. And this seemingly Pavlovian response proffered is
>>> and remains a bad policy idea. It is inimical to the spirit of volutarism -
>>> real voluntarism! - that premises the At-Large engagement.
>>> *Carlton A Samuels*
>>> *Mobile: 876-818-1799Strategy, Process, Governance, Assessment &
>>> On Tue, Jul 9, 2019 at 9:16 AM John Laprise <jlaprise at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> I would like us all to consider consequences for ATLASIII participants
>>>> who travel but do not participate (excepting reasons of illness etc). This
>>>> is a serious, professional responsibility and should be treated as such.
>>>> For a start, I would suggest that participants who fail to participate
>>>> should be ineligible for funding and elections for 3 years.
>>>> I look forward to conversation on this topic leading to action by the
>>>> Sent from my Pixel 3XL
>>>> John Laprise, Ph.D.
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>> can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or
>> configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or
>> disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.
> Greg Shatan
> greg at isoc-ny.org
> President, ISOC-NY
> *"The Internet is for everyone"*
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