[AFRI-Discuss] Call for comments (was Fwd: [ALAC] Final Report of the ALS Mobilization Working Party)

Alan Greenberg alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca
Wed Nov 11 23:11:56 UTC 2020

I note Seun's reply to this message, and I support everything he said.

However, As I have been mentioned here by name, I feel I must reply. 
See my embedded comments below.


At 2020-11-11 03:11 AM, Peters Omoragbon wrote:

>Hello Seun and All.
>I have made my inputs into the Google document as requested.
>Now flowing from the call last night, I think it will be expedient 
>for us to articulate our position as a RALO taking in all suggestions.
>You heard the masked remarks last night by Alan, after my 
>intervention when he said ALAC maybe inclined to act upon our 
>proposal if its a RALO proposal and not an individual, which to me 
>was misplaced. My position from time has not been an individual 
>position but that of my ALS. I represent my ALS and not myself.
>Some of our leaders in icann are not able to separate both.
>Another danger in the current  call of yesterday and tomorrow is a 
>ploy to give ALAC an undemocratic mandate to rail road this New 
>proposal to the Board with the claim that the Community including 
>all RALOs have been given the opportunity to discuss the new 
>proposal and they will put into vote. Maureen has a majority of 
>sympathisers in ALAC that can push this through.

AG: I cannon speak on behalf of the ALAC or Maureen, but I 
nevertheless STRONGLY object to the idea that the ALAC is doing 
anything "undemocratic". It is the ALAC that is given the authority 
to act on these matters and it does so with the involvement of RALOs. 
That is exactly as called forth in the ICANN Bylaws. To say that this 
is being "railroaded" is, in my opinion, offensive to all who have 
been and will be involved in the decision process.

>Which is why AFRALO may have to
>1. Formally write to ALAC to stand down ANY decision on this 
>document until we have enough time of about 40 days as recalled by 
>Sebastian last night or
>2. Work hard in the next 2wks to put up an Afralo position FOR ALAC.
>One danger those of us sitting on the fence is not sering is the 
>implication of this new ALS guidelines if not checked.
>1. ALAC wants to assume FULL control over the entire community 
>defeating the purpose of the principles of icann in terms of multi 
>stakeholders consensus on issues.

AG: I will leave it to others to judge what "the ALAC" wants, noting 
that 2/3 of the ALAC (a majority AND a super-majority) is selected by RALOs.

>2. RALOs are being gradually made redundant and with time may be 
>done away with, if not why would anyone propose that ALAC over sees 
>the activities of RALOs or that ALAC deal directly with Als and not 
>through RALO.

AG: Nothing in the proposal changes the relationship between the ALAC 
and ALSes and nothing is reducing the involvement of RALOs. In fact 
it is being increased in some areas. The ALAC has ALWAYS been the 
group that accredits ALSes and withdraws accreditation, and has 
always been the group that determines the rules for these actions.

>3. In the nearest future, the plan is to do away with ALSes and rely 
>on individual members. Icann will soon become an individual 
>organisation as opposed to organisational representation. Reason is 
>not far fetched, all the current people leading on this new 
>draconian changes do not belong to any organisation in their 
>constituency even if they do, they re no more but are involved in 
>icann as individuals. Which is fine but they should not destroy the 
>very fabric of what make icann what it is today.

AG: The ALAC and in particular I and several other leaders have 
worked tirelessly over the last 4 years (including as the Chair of 
the ALAC) to NOT eliminate ALSes as was recommended by the 
independent reviewer. I take great offence at the implication.

AG: And you seem to be confusing "ICANN" with "At-Large". Individuals 
have had a place in both At-Large and other parts of ICANN since the 
very beginning, and there are also parts of ICANN which you can join 
ONLY as specific types of organizations.

>4. Why would Alan refused to have the entire community look at the 
>draft and make recommendations before asking ALAC to revirw instead 
>of taking it straight to ALAC and now we are being made to look over 
>a document that took one year to develop in a 2 hour call.

AG: I did NOTHING OF THE SORT. I was asked to Chair an ALAC Working 
Party and that required us to report to the ALAC. That is not a 
conspiracy but simply following our normal processes. You and others 
took part in the WP and there was nothing preventing you from sharing 
the work we were doing. Some, including you, did that at times. And I 
made VERY sure that when this report went back to the ALAC, the RALO 
leaders were very aware of it and knew that they needed to provide 
RALO feedback.

AG: The 90 minute webinar was never meant to be the sole avenue for 
feedback and in fact, was not meant as a feedback session at all It 
was billed as an information session to give an overview of the 
proposed changes.

>  I can't get it. All the suggestions last night appeared to be a 
> waste of bcos he said it is left for ALAC to accept or not and no 
> more the WP! ALAC is composed of two third elected members by 
> RALOs. Its like Board or shares in a company. The RALOs have the 
> largest numbers of shares and should be the ones to call the shot 
> and not the other way. It is the dog that wags the tail and not the 
> tail wagging the dog.

AG: I do not understand. As you say, RALOs select 2/3 of the ALAC. 
How each RALO does its selection is up to the RALO. And presumably 
once they are there, they are serving their constituents. Most RALO 
ALAC members get re-appointed (unless their rules prevent it), so 
apparently the RALOs are happy with their performance.

>Finally, Seun and the Exco of AFRALO, the AFRALO call that was 
>initiated by my petition against the leadership of the WP did make 
>about 3 resolutions that was to be written to ALAC after the 
>meeting. Why was this not done because I cannot recall seeing that 
>document till date. Please, Seun and Sarah to please address us on this.

AG: I am not aware of any "petition against the leadership of the 
WP". As the sole WP Leader, I would dearly like to know more! I 
presume that any such "petition" will go to the ALAC Chair and will 
have the courtesy to copy me.

>Whatever it is worth, I have been like a lonely voice in the 
>wilderness while a lot of us are muted and I'm been seen as a bad 
>guy, but the fallout from these if not checked will not affect our Als alone.
>Yesterday someone said to Seun that the WP did not think along his 
>line of thoughts on the points he raised if not it would have been 
>dealt with. That was pure fallacy because I did both during calls 
>and in writing but some people just don't care because it is coming 
>from Pastor Peters. You cannot cut off your nose to spite your face remember.

AG: Pastor Peters, you raised some issues during the WP discussions 
that did not receive support for others. You are not alone, as I and 
others also raised issues that did not receive support. That is the 
nature of collaborative and consensus-driven work.

>Have a good day everyone. Posterity will judge all of us rightly or wrongly.
>Pastor Peters Omoragbon
>Get <https://aka.ms/ghei36>Outlook for Android
>From: AFRI-Discuss <afri-discuss-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org> on 
>behalf of Seun Ojedeji <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2020 6:32:24 AM
>To: afri-discuss <afri-discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
>Cc: aziz hilali <abdelaziz.hilali at gmail.com>
>Subject: Re: [AFRI-Discuss] Call for comments (was Fwd: [ALAC] Final 
>Report of the ALS Mobilization Working Party)
>Dear Members,
>As agreed during our last monthly call, we have put the final draft 
>of the report on googledocs. Please do not suggest edits but rather 
>add comments on any section of the document that you find to be of 
>concern, if you have a solution to the concern, you can indicate it 
>in your comment as well, we shall then compile any comments that 
>emerge and make a statement off it thereof.
>Here is the url to the googledocs: 
>Kindly put in your comments as soon as possible.
>Seun - AFRALO Chair
>On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 7:45 AM Seun Ojedeji 
><<mailto:seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>seun.ojedeji at gmail.com> wrote:
>Dear Members,
>The ALS mobilisation working party has completed its work and the 
>report is hereby attached for our comments. These report makes 
>recommendations on how present and future ALSes will operate within 
>AFRALO and At-large as a whole, hence it is important that members 
>look at the report and provide any feedback to on this.
>You may put your comments on this list(in response to my mail) or 
>you may write to me directly or to any of the AFRALO officers in 
>copy. We shall then attempt to put the various comments together in 
>form of a statement. I suggest we take the next 2 weeks for this as 
>the ALAC may be finalising on the report during the next ALAC 
>meeting. I will appreciate that comments are brief and specific with 
>reference to specific heading and page number in the document. I 
>will attempt to provide 2 examples below:
>What to expect from an ALS(page 3/4):
>The 3rd paragraph seem to give more decision powers to the ALT, when 
>it should rather be the entire ALAC that would grant such a waiver. 
>Preferrably such waiver may be receievd and granted by each RALO 
>leadership to avoid weilding too much power to the center
>Withdrawal of Accreditation (page 16):
>Bullet point 3 under item 2 suggests that staff should notify the 
>ALAC Chair who then oversees the process, i think it should rather 
>be a notification to the RALO leadership (perhaps with ALAC Chair in 
>copy) and the RALO leadership should oversee the process with an 
>action recommendation to the ALAC (through the ALAC Chair)
>Finally, while we have earlier invited the Chair of the working 
>party in person of Alan Greenberg to our special purpose call in the 
>past, there may be another call/webinar that will be scheduled. I 
>will provide more details about that as soon as i have it.
>Sent from my mobile
>Kindly excuse brevity and typos
>---------- Forwarded message ---------
>From: Alan Greenberg 
><<mailto:alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca>alan.greenberg at mcgill.ca>
>Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2020, 20:27
>Subject: [ALAC] Final Report of the ALS Mobilization Working Party
>To: ALAC <<mailto:alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org>alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
>Cc: ALS-Mob-WP <<mailto:als-mob-wp at icann.org>als-mob-wp at icann.org>
>Please find attached the Final Report of the ALS Mobilization Working
>Party (ALS-Mob-WP).
>I will be happy to formally make a presentation to the ALAC and
>At-Large Community at Maureen's convenience, and I can also do
>presentations to any RALO that wishes.
>The report is the result of ten months of work by the WP. Everything
>in it was determined by consensus and the vast majority by unanimous 
>The next step is a review by the ALAC and RALOs. Presumably the
>latter will be initiated by the ALAC Members from each region.
>Once the ALAC, with the support of the RALOs provides approval, the
>substance of the report will go to the ICANN Board for their
>agreement (or non-objection). Any Bylaw changes will be submitted to
>the Board and would be subject to the standard Bylaw amendment
>procedure as specified under Bylaws Article 25. In parallel with this
>report being submitted to the ALAC, the proposed Bylaw changes are
>being submitted to the Office of the General Counsel for their review
>and comments.
>Should the ALAC or Board require further modifications to the report,
>the WP will be reconvened.
>I will be happy to address and questions, comments or concerns.
>ALAC mailing list
><mailto:ALAC at atlarge-lists.icann.org>ALAC at atlarge-lists.icann.org
>At-Large Online: <http://www.atlarge.icann.org>http://www.atlarge.icann.org
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>Seun Ojedeji,
>Mobile: +2348035233535
>Bringing another down does not take you up - think about your action!
>AFRI-Discuss mailing list
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