[NA-Discuss] [At-Large] FW: Informationonrespectful communication
Dharma Dailey
dharma at ethoswireless.com
Mon Oct 29 23:20:50 EDT 2007
It takes a lot of effort to make things easy for people to
participate well.
I consider myself to be one of the people who has taken my ball and
gone home due to the culture around ICANN. Poor process= poor
outcomes and unhappy people. Poor process makes good people act
foolishly. I walked away from San Juan with a very favorable view of
most people that I met, but a very unfavorable view of the scene.
One argument that I would give for at-large as a separate entity from
an NGO centered body is the fact that there is a big cultural divide
between the way mom and pop groups build consensus and the way NGOs
do. I believe that culture-clash is part of what we are witnessing
in at-large. At-large is a kind of ad-hoc group trying to interact
within the "big NGO" culture of ICANN. In order to fix the
troubles of at-large -- and perhaps more generally ICANN itself-- it
will take a lot more than a chat with the ombudsmen. Within the
networks that I work most closely with- open source, appropriate
technology, community media, local broadband projects-- there is an
awareness that you need to have "process artists" in the fold of any
functioning group in order to make it cohere well enough to get stuff
done. *AND* unless its a very small affinity group -- there *MUST*
be more than one involved. You need a critical mass of people who
can corral people back to the agreed upon topic, the agreed upon
process for getting things done, and so forth. For groups as large
and international as the ones that meet around ICANN there is the
additional challenge that there are very distinctly different ways of
approaching the work that we each bring with us. Therefore the
people who are shepherds of the process need to be highly skilled.
They need have more than one or two tricks up their sleeves because
they won't make friends by saying, "This is what we do in XYZ place
and it always works for us."
While I can appreciate the sentiment of the PDF that Jaqueline sent
around, I think it is too general to be of use on its own. There are
some nice principles in it, but to actually get stuff done principles
need to be spelled out into clear modes of action. Recently,
Gareth Shearman of Telecommunities Canada and I went to an ARIN
(American Registry of Internet Numbers) meeting. It was both
amusing and refreshing to watch the cartoon at the Newcomers meeting
that modeled exactly how to speak at the open mic. It was both
ridiculous and a very useful tool to get up to speed on how to fully
participate in the odd little world that is ARIN. The cartoon leaves
nothing to the imagination in terms of process. I would say a good
2/3 of the ARIN community are "process artists" and they do seem to
be able to move through a lot of dense techno-political material in
an amazingly efficient way with lots of input from those present.
*And* the process is dynamic with suggestions from the community
constantly refining the process.
"Making friends" is also a critical part of volunteer, ad-hoc
groups. It should be fostered as it leads to better outcomes, higher
levels of participation, longer cycles of involvement and so forth.
Time honored traditions such as breaking bread are small investments
in the long run. Time for reflection and interaction among peers are
critical to plan into the work cycle. As far as I'm concerned, the
ancillary benefit of being able to rub elbows with others who care
about the social impact of networks outweighs the benefit of
participating in ICANN per se. Therefore, if there is value to
recruiting "people like me" into the ICANN process, the structure
leaves little incentive for me to be involved because 1) the
structure doesn't allow much lateral interaction 2) I'm not learning
much about how ICANN policies affect the issues I care about 3) It's
not fun to participate. In short, there is no payoff.
Those of you whom I spoke with in San Juan have heard me say this,
but I believe that it would be worthwhile to hire a trained
facilitator for the meetings and, for that matter, for the email
lists. Someone who has experience working within ad hoc structures.
At-Large has so much potential, and yet...
-Dharma Dailey
Emerging Futures Network
On 29-Oct-07, at 9:21 PM, Jacqueline A. Morris wrote:
> To repeat
>
> I did not refer anything to the Ombudsman, as ALAC Chair or as a
> private
> individual. However, if I were to do so as an individual, that
> would be
> confidential and I wouldn’t have to discuss with anyone. As Chair, I
> continue on the path of asking for respectful communication that
> has been
> ongoing for months. He’s one of the sources that I have checked as
> experts
> in the matter and he sent me info that I passed on. Other experts
> have
> provided input into the emails I have sent in the past, have
> provided other
> background information, etc. The Ombudsman is an ICANN resource,
> not only a
> tribunal.
>
> And others have indicated to me that they have approached the
> Ombudsman. I
> don’t expect that they will post to this list, as part of the
> problem is
> that they feel oppressed and unable to participate.
>
>
>
> You are perfectly within your rights to disagree with anything and
> everything on all lists. Just please do it without personal attacks,
> disrespect, threatening language, insults etc. As I have been
> asking for a
> while, as is in the NARALO code of conduct, as in the ALAC Rules. I
> haven’t
> indicated in any emails in public any persons from any region as
> being
> culpable. So this isn’t an anti-NA thing. There is no attempt to
> muzzle
> anyone from expressing their opinion in a respectful and polite
> manner.
> There however is an ongoing attempt to make these lists comfortable
> for
> everyone, from all regions, to express their opinions, to not be
> afraid to
> say what they think. I would hope that as great advocates of free
> speech, NA
> in particular would support actions taken to ensure the rights of
> all to
> participate freely.
>
>
>
> And before anyone takes this as proof that I think that this email
> is any of
> those things, I am saying this in a general way.
>
> Jacqueline
>
>
>
> From: Thompson, Darlene [mailto:DThompson at GOV.NU.CA]
> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 17:45
> To: jam at jacquelinemorris.com; Robert Guerra; NA Discuss
> Subject: RE: [NA-Discuss] [At-Large] FW: Informationonrespectful
> communication
>
>
>
> Jacqueline,
>
>
>
> It is still true that you did not get full support from ALAC to go
> to the
> Ombudsman.
>
>
>
> Cultural sensitivity goes both ways. I worded my e-mails as
> politely as
> possible but I sitll had to disagree with what was happening. I am
> really
> tired of people complaining about the lack of sensitivity from NA
> people.
> If it there were actually any insults or threats then you would be
> fully
> justified in doing what you did just as an individual. As ALAC
> Chair, you
> did not - not without a quorum from the ALAC - unless you made it
> clear that
> you were doing so as an individual. Using your power to stifle
> contrary
> view is not appropriate and I refuse to back down from this point.
>
>
>
> Therefore, what Robert says, still goes. I support him 100%.
>
>
>
> Darlene
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: na-discuss-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org on behalf of
> Jacqueline A.
> Morris
> Sent: Mon 10/29/2007 8:33 PM
> To: 'Robert Guerra'; 'NA Discuss'
> Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] [At-Large] FW: Informationonrespectful
> communication
>
> Robert
>
> Not at all.
>
> And I told you that in my reply to your private email to me.
>
> Mis-representing what I said is not kosher at all.
>
>
>
> I sent some info that was sent to me by Frank after a discussion with
> several people about how to improve the respect in online
> communication. He
> is the ICANN expert in this. This is a follow up to the emails I
> have sent
> previously on list communication.
>
>
>
> With regard to who has contacted the Ombudsman to date about emails
> sent to
> the public list (NOT the NARALO list) - I cannot say, as Ombudsman
> referrals are confidential and he hasn’t told me anything about
> that. Others
> have however indicated to me that they have considered approaching
> or have
> approached him about some emails on the public list. I haven’t been
> informed
> by anyone about complaints to him on any communication on the
> NARALO list to
> date.
>
>
>
> That is the correct information, and I hope that you will correct
> any emails
> that you have sent out with the erroneous information .
>
>
>
> Jacquelin
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Robert Guerra [mailto:lists at privaterra.info]
> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 17:03
> To: NA Discuss
> Subject: Re: [NA-Discuss] [At-Large] FW: Information onrespectful
> communication
>
>
>
> As some of you might have seen. it seem that Jacqueline thinks that
> comments
> from myself and others on NA RALO are soo inappropiate that it
> requires a
> referral to the ombudsman for his comment.
>
>
>
> Frankly, i'm amazed and shocked. I ask that if you feel strongly on
> this
> that you comment - ASAP.
>
>
>
> thanks
>
>
>
> Robert
>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>
>
> From: Robert Guerra <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:lists at privaterra.info"lists at privaterra.info>
>
> Date: October 29, 2007 4:59:08 PM PDT
>
> To: At-Large Global List <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org"alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
>
> Subject: Re: [At-Large] FW: Information onrespectful communication
>
>
>
> Jacqueline:
>
>
>
> Huh !
>
>
>
> Either don't understand your email, or am so surprised that as
> outgoing
> chair you would take such an action. To be hones, after a
> productive and
> team building day yesterday - you take this bombshell and drop this
> on us.
> i'm frankly shocked ...
>
>
>
>
>
> I am assuming correctly that differences of opinion are such that
> you - in
> your own personal capacity - are asking the ombudsman to pass a
> judgement
> on individuals in at-large that are exercising their freedom of
> speech?
>
>
>
> An action such as a referral should be done in consultation with
> the ALAC,
> and not done on your whim. Please seek the support of your peers,
> to take
> such drastic steps.
>
>
>
> Might I suggest that - instead - you seek the input of the alac,
> and see if
> indeed we concur with your course of action. If obtain support,
> fine. If
> not, then no course of action - should be obtain.
>
>
>
>
>
> In summary - I think I speak for many of those on the ALAC in
> saying, please
> seeking clarify your proposed actions. Personally, I think they are
> most
> inappropriate.
>
>
>
>
>
> regards,
>
>
>
> Robert
>
> ---
>
> Robert Guerra <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:rguerra at privaterra.ca"rguerra at privaterra.ca>
>
> Managing Director, Privaterra
>
> Tel +1 416 893 0377
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 29-Oct-07, at 4:01 PM, Jacqueline A. Morris wrote:
>
> 0" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Dear all
>
> As so many of the postings to this list are so disrespectful I have
> asked
> the Ombudsman for his input informally, before he gets brought into it
> formally by people who this has affected negatively. He has offered
> the
> following. Please read and attempt to follow some of the
> suggestions in the
> documents he has sent, so we can all work productively.
>
> Jacqueline
>
>
>
> From: frank.fowlie [HYPERLINK
> "mailto:frank.fowlie at icann.org"mailto:frank.fowlie at icann.org]
> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 15:51
> To: jacqueline Morris
> Subject:
>
>
>
> wellington comment from page 6 on
>
>
>
> and
>
>
>
>
>
> HYPERLINK
> "http://www.icann.org/ombudsman/respectful-communication.pdf"http://
> www.ican
> n.org/ombudsman/respectful-communication.pdf
>
>
>
> Frank Fowlie, MACAM
> Ombudsman
>
> The Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN)
> 4676 Admiralty Way, Suite 330
> Marina del Rey
> California, USA, 90292
>
> tel: +310-823-9358
> fax: +310-823-8649
>
> HYPERLINK "http://www.icannombudsman.org/"www.icannombudsman.org
>
> The Values of this Office are:
> -Respect for Diversity;
> -Excellence in Ombudsmanship;
> -Professionalism;
> -Confidentiality;
> -Impartiality;
> -and Independence.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1096 - Release Date:
> 10/27/2007
> 11:02
>
>
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1096 - Release Date:
> 10/27/2007
> 11:02
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1096 - Release Date:
> 10/27/2007
> 11:02
>
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1096 - Release Date:
> 10/27/2007
> 11:02
>
> <winmail.dat>
> ------
> NA-Discuss mailing list
> NA-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org
> http://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/na-discuss_atlarge-
> lists.icann.org
> Visit the NA-RALO Wiki at https://st.icann.org/naralo/
> ------
More information about the NA-Discuss
mailing list