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Of course thus is all different under gdpr so hardly worth the discussion <br>
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Jonathan Zuck<br>
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Executive Director<br>
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Innovators Network Foundation<br>
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<div id="x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> At-Large <at-large-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of Karl Auerbach <karl@cavebear.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, August 23, 2019 6:15:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Evan Leibovitch <evan@telly.org><br>
<b>Cc:</b> ICANN At-Large list <at-large@atlarge-lists.icann.org><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [At-Large] Sonoma Valley Hospital loses 3-letter domain name to hijackers</font>
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<div class="PlainText">Let's not let the word "property" or "ownership" color this discussion -
<br>
those words tend to drag-in a lot of preconceived notions.<br>
<br>
In law (at least in the US) there really is no such thing as <br>
"ownership". Rather various people (and governments, and other legally <br>
recognized entities such as corporations) may have various (and often <br>
overlapping) kinds of rights and duties with respect to a thing. We <br>
generally accord the word "owner" to whoever/whatever has the biggest <br>
collection of those rights/duties.<br>
<br>
Your concept of ICANN "owning" all domain names is interesting, however, <br>
because there can be multiple domain name systems, that would require a <br>
context such as "all domain names registered under such-and-such root <br>
zone file". Moreover, usually such a vast grant of ownership tends to <br>
require a governmental level of delegation - the days of Conquistadors <br>
planting flags are largely in our past. ;-)<br>
<br>
Given ICANN's history of kow-towing to certain industrial/governmental <br>
interests would we really want to accord this additional level of authority?<br>
<br>
Moving on...<br>
<br>
I find it better to consider the rights/duties surrounding domain names <br>
as contractual rights/duties. That tends to remove any lingering <br>
preconceptions that come from words like "property".<br>
<br>
ICANN as it is presently established does operate on the basis of <br>
contract rights and duties. (What is typically missing in the world of <br>
ICANN is the concept of "third party beneficiary" rights, which is the <br>
legal notion that a person - an intended or explicity beneficiary of the <br>
contract - but who is outside the contractual relationship may have the <br>
power to enforce terms of that contract.)<br>
<br>
Getting back to whois...<br>
<br>
I would assert that the data mining of whois has been a source of abuse <br>
of domain name registrants to at least the same degree, and perhaps a <br>
greater degree, than any asserted abuse by spammers. Virtually every <br>
person I know who has domain names has become the subject of a the <br>
hurricane of scam phone calls and emails originating from whois mined <br>
contact information. And that hurricane does not stop - I'm still <br>
getting stuff that is based on whois information that became obsolete <br>
30+ years ago. A large number of people have turned off their <br>
telephones - a fact that recognizes that ill-minded people are modern <br>
day Vandals who are undermining our modern culture as much as the elder <br>
Vandals undermined Classical Rome.<br>
<br>
You raise the scenario of a person having to pay money to report a <br>
crime. It is true that there is no $$ fee for that, but there are laws <br>
that make false reports a crime - make a false report and you could end <br>
up in jail yourself.<br>
<br>
There is no friction, no penalty, no nothing against anonymously <br>
perusing whois and redistributing that information. There are sometimes <br>
some notices of dubious legal applicability and enforceability. But <br>
when was the last time you read about a whois data miner going to jail <br>
or suffering a penalty?<br>
<br>
There's a balance to be made here. However the status quo is anything <br>
but a balance. The access to whois is free and easy, without penalty, <br>
cost, or friction; it can be made anonymously on a whim or mere <br>
curiosity - or as part of a mechanized data scraping operation. On the <br>
other side there is a violation of privacy, without prior-notice that <br>
the privacy will be violated, note of who violated that privacy, or what <br>
accusation, if any, is being made to justify that intrusion.<br>
<br>
Is if no wonder that registry privacy services are so popular?<br>
<br>
--karl--<br>
<br>
<br>
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