<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Healthy convos!<br><br><div id="AppleMailSignature">Javier RĂșa-Jovet<div><br></div><div><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">+1-787-396-6511</span></div><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">twitter: @javrua</span></div><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">skype: javier.rua1</span></div><div><font color="#000000" style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/javrua" style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">https://www.linkedin.com/in/javrua</a> </font></div><div><br></div></div></div><div><br>On Dec 10, 2018, at 12:53 PM, Christian de Larrinaga <<a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">cdel@firsthand.net</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>Evan,</span><br><span></span><br><span>Is the challenge one of structure and representation institutionally or</span><br><span>has the changes to empower an industry dependent on intermediation at</span><br><span>ICANN and Internet as a whole over the last few years squeezed out the</span><br><span>user stake in the DNS?</span><br><span></span><br><span>Perhaps the place to start is to ask if the growth of Internet users</span><br><span>since 1995 to today (16 million to c.4.1billion) is also reflected in</span><br><span>those users having a domain name. I don't get that impression. But it is</span><br><span>hard to get reliable data from ICANN or anywhere.</span><br><span></span><br><span>As to the health of the current domain registration market as a system</span><br><span>one could start by asking what is the proportion of registered domain</span><br><span>names that are actually being used and required for personal or</span><br><span>business, rather than for defensive reputational and brand purposes?</span><br><span></span><br><span>What would happen to the registries and registrars industry model</span><br><span>fostered by ICANN if users abandoned their defensive DNS registrations</span><br><span>as (local) regulators take up the slack?</span><br><span></span><br><span></span><br><span>Christian</span><br><span></span><br><span>Evan Leibovitch wrote:</span><br><blockquote type="cite"><span>Hi Christian,</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Given my experiences and observations... While I have totally stayed</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>away from the last At-Large review, I did one myself as a personal</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>mental exercise. </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>The conclusion I came to is that the current structure underneath ALAC</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>is overly politicized, appeals to superficial airs of importance, and</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>is at its core designed to be utterly impotent in regard to serving</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>its bylaw mandate.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Were I to be engaged in a real exercise to enable ALAC to serve its</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>bylaw mandate, I would wish to eliminate ALSs and move to fully</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>individual membership in RALOs. I would reduce travel and invest more</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>in vitual meeting technologies. I would also concentrate ALAC activity</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>in ONLY three areas:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>- Creation and distribution of plain language public education on the</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>DNS and how it affects public use of the internet (written</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>independently of ICANN itself) </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>- surveys and R&D into public needs and opinions about domain names</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>and the DNS</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>- analysis of the result of such research, and development of ICANN</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>input based on that (both in original policy initiatives and response</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>to existing activity) </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Any takers? I'm happy to engage if any interest exists. My rationale</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>behind this is quite deep and I'm happy to expand if interest exists. </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>___________________</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Evan Leibovitch, Toronto</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>@evanleibovitch/@el56</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>On Mon, Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 AM Christian de Larrinaga</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span><<a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">cdel@firsthand.net</a> <<a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">mailto:cdel@firsthand.net</a>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Given the clarity of these two comments. Maybe it is time to</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    consider a</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    straw poll over what future role and activity At Large</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    participants feel</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    is viable? Given the experience of the continuous perilous undermining</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    of the Internet edge by every digital miner with a pickaxe, shovel or</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    stick of dynamite?</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Christian</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Carlton Samuels wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Yessir, I can recall your exact words to me so long ago; waste of</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>time, decision already made. The reasoning you offered was bold,</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    too.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>I was interested at one point. Then when it was too clearly a bridge</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>too far, I retired to the shadows.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>A congressman from Texas once told a writer I truly loved that in</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>politics you have no right to call yourself a politician if you cant</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>drink their whiskey, take their women and money and still vote</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    against</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>them. Theres a lesson there somewhere.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>The arguments you hear on this or that are stimulating for a policy</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>wonk. But quite frankly at this point much of what the At-Large does</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>is margin-gathering.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Someone has to. And we live in hope.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>-Carlton</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>On Mon, 10 Dec 2018, 1:07 am Evan Leibovitch</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com">evanleibovitch@gmail.com</a> <<a href="mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com">mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com</a>></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><<a href="mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com">mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com">mailto:evanleibovitch@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    So... Do all of you who sank your valuable time into that</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    where-do-the-auction-funds-go sham of a process feel a little</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    betrayed now?</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    How many more times will we continue to play this futile game?</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    The fix is always in. Let the "community" thrash about with</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    well-meaning but big-picture-pointless debate, then swoop in at</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    the end to remind where the ultimate decision lies. It lies with</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    the money.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    I got fooled enough with the Applicant Support process, the CCT</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    and a few others. Yeah, it's more than one but at least I</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    can say</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    I know the experience intimately. But the aftermath of these</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    efforts (or lack thereof) is why you don't see me wasting my</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    time</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    on subsequent ones. (Cue the theme music from "CSI:Miami".)</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Countless of my colleagues continue the good-faith attempt to</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    disprove Einstein's definition of insanity(*), unsuccessfully. I</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    love my ALAC friends (I've literally invited you to my home) and</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    it pains me to watch the story repeat so often.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    But sooner or later the collective massochism and denial has to</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    end. Turnover in ALAC is low enough to have plenty of veterans</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    around who should know better.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Stop playing the game. Challenge the rules instead. Perfect</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    example: why is ALAC involved in the minutiae of "subsequent</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    procedures" for new rounds of gTLDs without having even</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    challenged</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    the rationale for new rounds at all? Also, I've previously</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    spoken</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    at length about ALAC's sad longtime choice to respond to the</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    agendas of others rather than even try to set its own.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Monied interests overpower us politically by orders of</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    magnitude,</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    and without a regulatory role ICANN has no incentive to push</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    against the money. This needs to be changed, or others will</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    change</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    it from the outside.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    I remind that we are now living through a period of time in</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    which</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    awful political choices are being made, all over the world, in</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    desperate moves to disrupt deaf and corrupt status quo.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    ICANN and</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    ALAC ignore this trend at their danger.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    ___________________</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Evan Leibovitch, Toronto</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    @evanleibovitch/@el56</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    (*) that may not have ever actually been said by Einstein, but</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    it's a useful phrase regardless of source.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    On Dec 9, 2018 12:34 AM, "Carlton Samuels"</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com">carlton.samuels@gmail.com</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com">mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com</a>></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com">mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com">mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com</a>>>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>        <a href="https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/12/07/dot_web_review/">https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/12/07/dot_web_review/</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>_______________________________________________</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>At-Large mailing list</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="mailto:At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org">At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <<a href="mailto:At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org">mailto:At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a>></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large">https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>At-Large Official Site: <a href="http://atlarge.icann.org">http://atlarge.icann.org</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    -- </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    Christian de Larrinaga</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    @ FirstHand</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    -------------------------</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    +44 7989 386778</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>    <a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">cdel@firsthand.net</a> <<a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">mailto:cdel@firsthand.net</a>></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><span></span><br><span>-- </span><br><span>Christian de Larrinaga</span><br><span>@ FirstHand</span><br><span>-------------------------</span><br><span>+44 7989 386778</span><br><span><a href="mailto:cdel@firsthand.net">cdel@firsthand.net</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>At-Large mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org">At-Large@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large">https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/at-large</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>At-Large Official Site: <a href="http://atlarge.icann.org">http://atlarge.icann.org</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>