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After opposing greater accountability of ICANN through a membership
based model, ALAC leadership seems also eager to *not* support
increased transparency.... (Now, please dont cite technical reasons,
people normally employ 'technical reasons' and 'facts' in pursuance
of what they want accomplished and not against it)<br>
<br>
And ALAC is supposed to be the representative of the
'outsiders'.....A really strange world, i'd say!<br>
<br>
parminder
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<th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE">Subject:
</th>
<td>Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Transparency recap (Was: Contribution on
Transparency Reforms for CCWG)</td>
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<th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE">Date: </th>
<td>Fri, 30 Oct 2015 14:17:44 +0000</td>
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<tr>
<th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE">From: </th>
<td>Alan Greenberg <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca"><alan.greenberg@mcgill.ca></a></td>
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<th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE">To: </th>
<td>Chris Disspain <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ceo@auda.org.au"><ceo@auda.org.au></a>, Schaefer, Brett
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Brett.Schaefer@heritage.org"><Brett.Schaefer@heritage.org></a></td>
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<th align="RIGHT" nowrap="nowrap" valign="BASELINE">CC: </th>
<td><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org"><accountability-cross-community@icann.org></a></td>
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</style>Transparency is needed, but the CCWG identified this as a WS2
issue. Yes, when we were talking about membership, some of this
automatically would be provided, but it was not de facto a WS1
issue. To add it now is mission creap. <br>
-- <br>
Sent from my mobile. Please excuse brevity and typos.<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On October 30, 2015 11:34:29 AM
GMT+00:00, Chris Disspain <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ceo@auda.org.au"><ceo@auda.org.au></a> wrote:
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
<span style="font-family: 'Verdana'; font-size: 13px; color:
rgb(102, 102, 102);">I disagree. I do not believe there is
yet consensus.
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">I am not in favour of any ârightsâ other
than the enforcement rights already agreed being given to
the designator. I have no issue with the right of
inspection being given to the SOs and ACs pursuant to an
agreed level of consensus.
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<div class="">
<p class="p1"><br class="">
</p>
<p class="p2">Cheers,</p>
<p class="p3"><br class="">
</p>
<p class="p2">Chris Disspain<span class="s1"> </span><span
class="s2">|</span><span class="s1"> </span>Chief
Executive Officer</p>
<p class="p2">.au Domain Administration Ltd</p>
<p class="p2">T: <span class="s3">+61 3 8341 4111</span><span
class="s1"> </span><span class="s2">|</span><span
class="s1"> </span>F: <span class="s3">+61 3 8341
4112</span></p>
<p class="p4"><span class="s4">E:</span><span
class="s1"> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ceo@auda.org.au" class=""><span
class="s5">ceo@auda.org.au</span></a> </span><span
class="s6">|</span><span class="s1"> </span><span
class="s4">W:</span><span class="s7"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.auda.org.au/" class=""><span
class="s8">www.auda.org.au</span></a></span><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p>
<p class="p2">auDA â Australiaâs Domain Name
Administrator</p>
<p class="p5"><br class="">
</p>
<p class="p6"><span class="s6"><b class="">Important
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<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On 30 Oct 2015, at 22:25 , Schaefer,
Brett <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Brett.Schaefer@heritage.org"
class="">Brett.Schaefer@heritage.org</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">Matthieu,<br class="">
<br class="">
I may be wrong, but based on the comments on the
list and in Dublin that there is broad agreement,
I would even say consensus, that the right to
inspect needs to be granted to the designator.<br
class="">
<br class="">
The discussion recently has focused on how much of
the other transparency provisions to bring forward
to WS1. I and others think a substantial amount,
others disagree. If a compromise or centrist
position is being sought, I suggest it that it
focus on these items of dispute.<br class="">
<br class="">
Thanks,<br class="">
<br class="">
Brett<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
________________________________<br class="">
Brett
Schaefer<br class="">
Jay Kingham Senior Research Fellow in
International Regulatory Affairs<br class="">
Margaret Thatcher Center for Freedom Davis
Institute for National Security and Foreign Policy<br
class="">
The Heritage Foundation<br class="">
214 Massachusetts Avenue, NE<br class="">
Washington, DC 20002<br class="">
202-608-6097<br class="">
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://heritage.org" class="">heritage.org</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://heritage.org/" class="">http://heritage.org/</a>><br
class="">
<br class="">
On Oct 30, 2015, at 5:24 AM, Edward Morris <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:egmorris1@toast.net" class="">egmorris1@toast.net</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:egmorris1@toast.net" class="">mailto:egmorris1@toast.net</a>>>
wrote:<br class="">
<br class="">
Mathieu,<br class="">
<br class="">
Thank you very much for this post. I want to
succinctly thank the Chairs for their exemplary
leadership on this issue, express my support for
their rational, considered, centered and measur ed
approach to transparency and inspection issues,
and express my full support for the approach
indicated, with work beyond the transposing of
certain provisions from the old reference model
into into the new reference model to be tackled in
work stream 2. It is an approach between the two
extremes recently debated on list and as a
centrist in most things in life find it a
reasonable way forward that should provide us with
the best opportunity to get this done right.
Thanks again.<br class="">
<br class="">
Best,<br class="">
<br class="">
Ed Morris<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Sent from my iPhone<br class="">
<br class="">
On Oct 30, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Mathieu Weill <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mathieu.weill@afnic.fr" class="">mathieu.weill@afnic.fr</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mathieu.weill@afnic.fr" class="">mailto:mathieu.weill@afnic.fr</a>>>
wrote:<br class="">
<br class="">
Dear Colleagues,<br class="">
<br class="">
First of all many thanks to all of you wh o have
been working hard on this issue. We are well aware
of your efforts to find an approach that would be
acceptable to all on this question.<br class="">
<br class="">
Regarding transparency discussions, I would like
to remind everyone of the content and conclusions
of our discussions on Transparency in the Sole
Designator model while we were in Dublin.<br
class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
- Our lawyers have confirmed that the
same level of transparency could be achieved in
the Sole Designator model as with the Sole Member,
by adding a specific provision to the Bylaws
enabling the Sole Designator to inspect Icanâs
accounting books and records.<br class="">
<br class="">
- In response to a concern raised by Sam
Eisner about public disclosure of such documents,
we discussed how we could use the same type of
provision that we had agreed on for the AoC
reviews as a
safeguard (see below the relevant extract from the
AoC section, provided by Steve del Bianco)<br
class="">
<br class="">
- There was a debate about whether or not
extra provisions for transparency were needed in
Work stream 1, considering that we have agreement
that the topic is on the WS2 agenda. There was no
formal conclusion.<br class="">
<br class="">
Thomas did conclude by saying âSo thatâs one
action item for our group to set up a subteam to
define the exact language and extent to which a
transparency is required.â<br class="">
<br class="">
In terms of way forward, given the input we have
received, I believe the question is whether
transparency provisions, beyond the records
inspection rights, fit with our agreed definition
of Work stream 1, and whether the level of
consensus on the extra provisions at this stage is
sufficient.<br class="">
<br class="">
I would note that, with the groupâs input, our
WS2
initiative would already be well advanced. It
might be possible to launch it very soon after we
have submitted our WS1 recommendations if that is
the path we take.<br class="">
<br class="">
Best,<br class="">
Mathieu<br class="">
<br class="">
For your reference :<br class="">
Full transcript --> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/56143884/Transcript%20CCWG%20ACCT%20Working%20Session%202_21%20October.pdf?version=1&modificationDate=1445525810000&api=v2"
class="">https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/56143884/Transcript%20CCWG%20ACCT%20Working%20Session%202_21%20October.pdf?version=1&modificationDate=1445525810000&api=v2</a><br
class="">
Slide-deck --> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/56143884/CCWG-Accountability%20Working%20Session%20II%20%281%29-1.pdf?version=1&modificationDate=1445444965000&api=v2"
class="">https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/56143884/CCWG-Accountability%20Working%20Session%20II%20%281%29-1.pdf?version=1&modificationDate=1445444965000&api=v2</a><br
class="">
<br class="">
page 75 of AoC reviews as part of WS1.<br class="">
Confidential Disclosure to Review Teams:<br
class="">
To facilitate transparency and openness regarding
ICANN's deliberations and operations, the Review
Teams, or a subset thereof, shall have access to
ICANN internal information and documents. If ICANN
refuses to reveal documents or information
requested by the Review Team, ICANN must provide a
justification to the Review Team. If the Review
Team is not satisfied with ICANNâs
justification, it can appeal to the Ombudsman
and/or the ICANN Board for a ruling on the
disclosure request.<br class="">
<br class="">
For documents and information that ICANN does
disclose to the Review Team, ICANN may designate
certain documents and information as not for
disclosur e by
the Review Team, either in its report or
otherwise. If the Review Team is not satisfied
with ICANNâs designation of non-disclosable
documents or information, it can appeal to the
Ombudsman and/or the ICANN Board for a ruling on
the non-disclosure designation.<br class="">
<br class="">
A confidential disclosure framework shall be
published by ICANN. The confidential disclosure
framework shall describe the process by which
documents and information are classified,
including a description of the levels of
classification that documents or information may
be subject to, and the classes of persons who may
access such documents and information.<br class="">
<br class="">
The confidential disclosure framework shall
describe the process by which a Review Team may
request access to documents and information that
are designated as classified or restricted access.<br
class="">
<br class="">
The confidential disclosure framework shall also
describe the provisions of any non-discl osure
agreement that members of a Review Team may be
asked to sign.<br class="">
<br class="">
The confidential disclosure framework must provide
a mechanism to escalate and/or appeal the refusal
to release documents and information to duly
recognized Review Teams.<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
De : <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org"
class="">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org"
class="">mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org"
class="">mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>]
De la part de Kieren McCarthy<br class="">
Envoyé : jeudi 29 octobre 2015 15:58<br class="">
à : Padmini<br class="">
Cc : <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org"
class="">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org"
class="">mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>><br
class="">
Objet : Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Contribution on
Transparency Reforms for CCWG<br class="">
<br class="">
I have to agree with Padmini on this one re: DIDP
and being "able to refer the requestor to
documents already publicly available".<br class="">
<br class="">
The information provided is often tangential to
what has actually been asked for. In quite a few
cases it is so far removed from the query that it
is almost obnoxious.<br class="">
<br class="">
I don't know why Board members have such a blind
spot about how the staff behaves to those outside
the corporation.<br class="">
<br class="">
And I'm still waiting to hear a Board member - any
Board member - announce that they have decided to
look into the staff's bylaw-breaking behavior in
the .africa application.<br class="">
<br class="">
If I was on the Board and I heard that th e
entire process was being jeopardized by staff
wrongly interfering in the process (and then lying
about doing so), I'd make sure the community knew
I was doing my job and insist on some kind of
internal review of what happened and what could be
done to make sure it didn't happen again.<br
class="">
<br class="">
But instead we get silence and fantasy responses
like these ones from Bruce about how the DIDP
works and the effectiveness of ICANN's financial
reporting systems.<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
Kieren<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 5:41 AM, Padmini <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:pdmnbaruah@gmail.com" class="">pdmnbaruah@gmail.com</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:pdmnbaruah@gmail.com" class="">mailto:pdmnbaruah@gmail.com</a>>>
wrote:<br class="">
Dear Bruce,<br class="">
As someone who has spent some time combing through
the different responses that ICANN files to the
various DIDP requests, my findings are slightly
different, and have been posted earlier.<br
class="">
While ICANN does link one to an innumerable array
of documents that are publicly available, many
times, there is little or no connection between
the information one seeks and the publicly
available documents that are provided. For
instance, I have asked a few questions on
registrar/registry audits, specifically seeking
individual contracted party audit reports in cases
where there have been breaches or discrepancies.
However, the response contains a large number of
links explaining ICANN's three-year-audit process
in great detail, and at the end has a rejection of
my actual request on the basis of certain of their
extremely vast and broad grounds for
non-disclosure. I like to refer to this as ICANN's
tendency towards documentary obfuscation where
they aren't actually giving you the information
that you need, but are drowning you in documents
anyway.<br class="">
That 66 is a figure that we might need to
scrutinise closer in
terms of how effective those disclosures actually
have been.<br class="">
Warm Regards<br class="">
Padmini<br class="">
Programme Associate, Internet Governance<br
class="">
Centre for Internet and Society, Bangalore, India<br
class="">
<br class="">
Padmini Baruah<br class="">
V Year, B.A.LL.B. (Hons.)<br class="">
NLSIU, Bangalore<br class="">
<br class="">
On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 12:16 PM, Bruce Tonkin
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au"
class="">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au"
class="">mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a>>>
wrote:<br class="">
Hello Greg,<br class="">
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class=""> 6333. The
accounting books and records and minutes of
proceedings<br class="">
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
of the members and the board and committees of the
board shall be<br class="">
open to inspection upon the written dem and on
the corporation of any<br class="">
member at any reasonable time, for a purpose
reasonably related to<br class="">
such person's interests as a member.<br class="">
<br class="">
The minutes are basically published today. The
only minutes apparently that are not posted are
compensation committee minutes â but even then
we could at least note the items discussed without
necessarily disclosing some personal information.<br
class="">
<br class="">
With regard to financialsâ we are already moving
towards the same standards as publicly listed
companies in the USA. We now provide quarterly
financial reporting, and a quarterly call where
the community can question the CEO and the CFO on
the income and expenditure. It would not be
normal to provide people with access to the raw
accounting system (in this case Great Plains) â
which would include information on payments to all
staff etc.<br class="">
<br class="">
We do use an ex ternal
auditor to validate our financials and processes
once per year.<br class="">
<br class="">
If there is a community concern about a
particular financial matter (e.g concern about
whether procurement policies were being followed)
â then I think it would be more appropriate if
the single legal entity that represents the
community powers has the right to appoint an
external auditor to validate any particular
process or numbers and report back to the
community. Audit firms have the appropriate
skills to analyse financial accounting records and
also have appropriate procedures in place for
confidentiality.<br class="">
<br class="">
I think we should be focussing on improving the
processes we already have. I advocated moving to
quarterly financial reporting, and I have
certainly been a strong advocate of making things
as public as possible, and welcome suggestions for
improving our processes.<br class="">
<br class="">
Regards ,<br class="">
Bruce Tonkin<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
<br class="">
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