[ALAC] Fwd: Re: Re: [APAC-Discuss] ccTLD Revocation

Eduardo Diaz eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com
Wed Dec 4 15:50:03 UTC 2013


As a matter of practical matter the IANA operator should follow the
government mandate regardless of "colouration". Otherwise who is the judge?

-ed


On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 5:32 PM, Carlton Samuels
<carlton.samuels at gmail.com>wrote:

> On principle yes, I could agree with Eduardo. But as a practical matter,
> 'colouration' of the government will always be an issue.
>
> So then as a practical matter, I am loathe to believe that a request -for
> example - from one of the little fellas or one of those places where the
> cult of personality is the supreme law..or where they count the votes
> before they are cast....should be both compelling and binding.
>
> -Carlton
>
>
> ==============================
> Carlton A Samuels
> Mobile: 876-818-1799
> *Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment & Turnaround*
> =============================
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 1:27 AM, Rinalia Abdul Rahim <
> rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Dear Keith,
> >
> > Please have a look at Eduardo's response (forwarded below), which is
> guided
> > by a real case.
> >
> > Can you kindly venture into the shades of  nuance to address the
> situation
> > that he has highlighted?
> >
> > I think this discussion will be useful for the ALAC in considering its
> > input on revocation.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Rinalia
> >  ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > From: "Eduardo Diaz" <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>
> > Date: Dec 2, 2013 7:12 AM
> > Subject: Re: Re: [APAC-Discuss] ccTLD Revocation
> > To: "Rinalia Abdul Rahim" <rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com>
> > Cc:
> >
> > Rinalia:
> > >
> > > Governments may be treated as another stakeholder as far as the
> RFC-1591
> > > is concerned but a government with a mandate, e.g. a "local law", to
> > > revocate, should have more weight and standing than any other
> > stakeholder.
> > > So the question still stands: if a government requests a revocation
> > without
> > > reaching a consent with the ccTLD manager, will the IANA operator send
> it
> > > back to be resolved locally?  If so, the ccTLD manager has the last
> > saying
> > > in the whole process. The applicability of "local law" in the RFC 1591
> > > should be clearly interpreted by the framework to cover cases like
> these.
> > >
> > > -ed
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 2:15 AM, Rinalia Abdul Rahim <
> > > rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Ed,
> > >>
> > >> what do you think?
> > >>
> > >> Rinalia
> > >> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> > >> From: "Keith Davidson" <keith at internetnz.net.nz>
> > >> Date: Nov 22, 2013 3:26 AM
> > >> Subject: Re: [APAC-Discuss] ccTLD Revocation
> > >> To: "Rinalia Abdul Rahim" <rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com>
> > >> Cc: "apralo" <apac-discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>, "ALAC Working
> > List"
> > >> <alac at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
> > >>
> > >> Hi Rinalia, all,
> > >>
> > >> We have discussed the concept of Governments vs other parties who
> seek a
> > >> revocation, and see no reason to differentiate governments from any
> > other
> > >> stakeholder group in this regard. In terms of the policies outlined in
> > >> RFC1591, governments are not accorded any special status, but
> references
> > >> are made to the applicability of "local law" instead.
> > >>
> > >> The shades of nuance of the difference, or sameness of this could take
> > >> quite some debate - which I am happy to entertain if you think it
> > useful.
> > >>
> > >> Cheers
> > >>
> > >> Keith
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On 22/11/2013 6:55 a.m., Rinalia Abdul Rahim wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Keith,
> > >>>
> > >>> Thank you for jumping in on this issue.  Can you clarify on whether
> the
> > >>> WG discussed in any way how revocation should be handled if it is
> > >>> requested by governments and if there are special criteria that would
> > >>> apply in such cases?
> > >>>
> > >>> Best regards,
> > >>>
> > >>> Rinalia
> > >>>
> > >>> On Nov 22, 2013 1:46 AM, "Keith Davidson" <keith at internetnz.net.nz
> > >>> <mailto:keith at internetnz.net.nz>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>     Just as an aside, I am the Chair of the Working Group that
> drafted
> > >>>     the Revocation document as part of the overall Framework of
> > >>>     Interpretation working group in ICANN, so if there are issues or
> > >>>     clarifications required on this, I would be happy to discuss with
> > >>>     folks on this list.
> > >>>
> > >>>     Cheers
> > >>>
> > >>>     Keith
> > >>>
> > >>>     On 22/11/2013 2:09 a.m., Rinalia Abdul Rahim wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>         Dear Sala,
> > >>>
> > >>>         There is time for input, but the urgency level must be
> > >>>         maintained as the
> > >>>         ALAC is scheduled to vote on the statement on 12th December.
> I
> > >>>         recognize
> > >>>         that the issue affects many interested parties, which is why
> I
> > >>>         sent out a
> > >>>         second call for comments recently.  I look forward to more
> > input
> > >>>         on the
> > >>>         important topic of revocation from the community with
> Maureen's
> > >>>         mobilization and coordination.
> > >>>
> > >>>         Thank you for your help.
> > >>>
> > >>>         Best regards,
> > >>>
> > >>>         Rinalia
> > >>>
> > >>>         On Nov 21, 2013 8:48 PM, "Sala T" <sala at pasifikanexus.nu
> > >>>         <mailto:sala at pasifikanexus.nu>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>             Dear Rinalia,
> > >>>
> > >>>             Thank you for this. Since this first came out, I had sent
> > it
> > >>>             to the region
> > >>>             and also to the Regulators, ccTLD managers and Government
> > >>>             Policy makers. I
> > >>>             had a meeting with Pacific Regional Regulators Resource
> > >>>             Center which is a
> > >>>             unit comprising all the Regulators and Policy makers.
> Some
> > >>>             of them are also
> > >>>             members of ALSes in the Pacific.
> > >>>
> > >>>             There was overwhelming response that they were busy with
> > >>>             Plenipotentiary
> > >>>             preparations.
> > >>>
> > >>>             I will be having another meeting with some of them for
> the
> > >>>             purpose of
> > >>>             feeding into the process and hopefully by crowd-sourcing
> > >>>             where there are
> > >>>             geographical challenges. I will work with Maureen to feed
> > >>>             this into the
> > >>>             wiki etc. This may involve having a specific webinar and
> > >>>             will brief Maureen
> > >>>             and get her to take the lead on this as she is ALAC and
> > >>>             ccNSO liaison.
> > >>>
> > >>>             Please give us time to put submissions in.
> > >>>
> > >>>             Best Regards,
> > >>>             Sala
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>             Sent from my iPad
> > >>>
> > >>>                 On Nov 19, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Rinalia Abdul Rahim <
> > >>>
> > >>>             rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com
> > >>>             <mailto:rinalia.abdulrahim at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>                 Dear At-Large Colleagues,
> > >>>
> > >>>                 The ALAC is preparing a statement on the topic of
> ccTLD
> > >>>                 "revocation",
> > >>>
> > >>>             which
> > >>>
> > >>>                 refers to a process where the IANA Operator rescinds
> > the
> > >>>                 responsibility
> > >>>
> > >>>             for
> > >>>
> > >>>                 the management of a ccTLD from the manager.  In such
> a
> > >>>                 situation, a
> > >>>
> > >>>             country
> > >>>
> > >>>                 code Top Level Domain will be re-delegated without
> the
> > >>>                 consent of the
> > >>>                 incumbent ccTLD manager in cases where there are
> > >>>                 “persistent problems
> > >>>
> > >>>             with
> > >>>
> > >>>                 the operations of the domain” and where there
> continues
> > >>>                 to be
> > >>>
> > >>>             “substantial
> > >>>
> > >>>                 misbehavior” on the part of ccTLD managers despite
> the
> > >>>                 IANA Operator’s
> > >>>
> > >>>             best
> > >>>
> > >>>                 efforts to stop the misconduct.
> > >>>
> > >>>                 A draft statement has been prepared and is available
> > for
> > >>>                 your
> > >>>
> > >>>             input/comment
> > >>>
> > >>>                 on the following wikipage:
> > >>>                 https://community.icann.org/__
> > >>> pages/viewpage.action?pageId=__43980716
> > >>>
> > >>>                 <https://community.icann.org/
> > >>> pages/viewpage.action?pageId=43980716>
> > >>>
> > >>>                 If you have thoughts or opinions on this topic,
> please
> > >>>                 do provide your
> > >>>                 input/comments on the wikipage.
> > >>>
> > >>>                 Thank you.
> > >>>
> > >>>                 Best regards,
> > >>>
> > >>>                 Rinalia
> > >>>                 _________________________________________________
> > >>>                 APAC-Discuss mailing list
> > >>>                 APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.__icann.org
> > >>>                 <mailto:APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
> > >>>                 https://atlarge-lists.icann.__
> > >>> org/mailman/listinfo/apac-__discuss
> > >>>
> > >>>                 <
> > https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/apac-
> > >>> discuss>
> > >>>
> > >>>                 Homepage for the region: http://www.apralo.org
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>         _________________________________________________
> > >>>         APAC-Discuss mailing list
> > >>>         APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.__icann.org
> > >>>         <mailto:APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
> > >>>         https://atlarge-lists.icann.
> > __org/mailman/listinfo/apac-__discuss
> > >>> <https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/apac-discuss>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>         Homepage for the region: http://www.apralo.org
> > >>>
> > >>>     _________________________________________________
> > >>>     APAC-Discuss mailing list
> > >>>     APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.__icann.org
> > >>>     <mailto:APAC-Discuss at atlarge-lists.icann.org>
> > >>>     https://atlarge-lists.icann.
> __org/mailman/listinfo/apac-__discuss
> > >>>
> > >>>     <https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/apac-discuss>
> > >>>
> > >>>     Homepage for the region: http://www.apralo.org
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >
> > >
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